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Hinter den Kulissen von C&C; /
Hintergrundinfos :: Insider-Wissen über Renegade 2, Continuum, Stories, C&C3;,...
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Inhalte - Hinter den Kulissen von C&C; |
Hintergrundinfos :: Insider-Wissen über Renegade 2, Continuum, Stories, C&C3;,... |
In den Foren des Spieleentwicklers Petroglyph äußern sich die Entwickler gerne mal zu diversen Themen. Da viele Mitarbeiter des noch recht jungen Unternehmens (mit  Star Wars Empire at War erst ein veröffentlichtes Spiel) früher bei den  Westwood Studios beschäftigt waren, betreffen sehr viele Themen und Diskussionen verständlicherweise das Command & Conquer Universum. Wir nahmen dies zum Anlass und fassen für euch die Infos der Originalposts zusammen, ebenso wie wir zur Erklärung erneut ein wenig Hintergrundwissen veröffentlichen.
Wenn du mehr Infos zu alternativen C&C3; Stories, der Verbindung der C&C-Universen; miteinander, C&C; Continuum, Renegade 2 oder "Tiberian Twillight" haben willst, dann solltest du unbedingt weiterlesen!
Adam P. Isgreen, Nickname "Ishmael", ist Creative Director bei Petroglyph und arbeitete zuvor bei EA Los Angeles und den Westwood Studios, unter anderem an Command & Conquer. Von ihm stammen wohl die meisten bestätigten "Insider"-Informationen bezüglich Command & Conquer. Doch auch Bekanntheiten wie Frank Klepacki, zuständig für die Sounds und Musik in diversen Videospielen, arbeiten nun ebenso für Petroglyph, und melden sich ab und zu zu Wort.
 Spieleliste Adam P. Isgreen
Star Wars: Empire at War (2006), Activision (UK) Limited
Star Wars: Empire at War - Forces of Corruption (2006), LucasArts
Command & Conquer: Generals - Zero Hour (2003), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Earth & Beyond (2002), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Emperor: Battle for Dune (2001), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Red Alert 2 (2000), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Red Alert 2 (Collector's Edition) (2000), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Tiberian Sun - Firestorm (2000), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Tiberian Sun (1999), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Tiberian Sun (Platinum Edition) (1999), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Lands of Lore III (1999), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Dune 2000 (1998), Westwood Studios, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Red Alert - Counterstrike (1997), Virgin Interactive Entertainment, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Sole Survivor (1997), Westwood Studios, Inc.
Command & Conquer (Special Gold Edition) (1997), Westwood Studios, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Red Alert (1996), Virgin Interactive Entertainment, Inc.
World of Aden: Thunderscape (1995), Mindscape, Inc., Strategic Simulations, Inc.
Dark Sun: Wake of the Ravager (1994), Strategic Simulations, Inc.
Dark Sun: Shattered Lands (1993), Softgold Computerspiele GmbH
Spieleliste Frank Klepacki
Star Wars: Empire at War (2006), Activision (UK) Limited
Star Wars: Empire at War - Forces of Corruption (2006), LucasArts
Command & Conquer: Renegade (2002), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Earth & Beyond (2002), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Pirates: The Legend of Black Kat (2002), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Yuri's Revenge (2001), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Emperor: Battle for Dune (2001), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Red Alert 2 (2000), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Red Alert 2 (Collector's Edition) (2000), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Tiberian Sun - Firestorm (2000), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Nox (2000), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Tiberian Sun (1999), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Tiberian Sun (Platinum Edition) (1999), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Lands of Lore III (1999), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Dune 2000 (1998), Westwood Studios, Inc.
Blade Runner (1997), Virgin Interactive Entertainment, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Red Alert - Counterstrike (1997), Virgin Interactive Entertainment, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Red Alert - The Aftermath (1997), Virgin Interactive Entertainment, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Sole Survivor (1997), Westwood Studios, Inc.
Command & Conquer (Special Gold Edition) (1997), Westwood Studios, Inc.
Lands of Lore: Guardians of Destiny (1997), Virgin Interactive Entertainment, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Red Alert (1996), Virgin Interactive Entertainment, Inc.
Command & Conquer: The Covert Operations (1996), Virgin Interactive Entertainment, Inc.
Command & Conquer (1995), Virgin Interactive Entertainment (Europe) Ltd.
Monopoly (1995), Hasbro Interactive, Inc.
The Legend of Kyrandia: Malcolm's Revenge (1994), Virgin Interactive Entertainment, Inc.
The Lion King (1994), Virgin Interactive Entertainment, Inc., Walt Disney Computer Software, Inc.
Lands of Lore: The Throne of Chaos (1993), Virgin Games, Inc.
The Legend of Kyrandia: Hand of Fate (1993), Virgin Games, Inc.
Young Merlin (1993), Virgin Games, Inc.
DragonStrike (1992), FCI, Pony Canyon, Inc.
Dune II: The Building of a Dynasty (1992), Virgin Games, Inc.
Dungeons & Dragons: Warriors of the Eternal Sun (1992), SEGA Enterprises Ltd.
The Legend of Kyrandia (1992), Virgin Games, Inc.
Eye of the Beholder II: The Legend of Darkmoon (1991), Strategic Simulations, Inc.
DragonStrike (1990), Strategic Simulations, Inc.
Doch kommen wir zum spannenden Teil, denn es gibt Infos zu alternativen C&C3; Stories, der Verbindung der C&C-Universen; miteinander, C&C; Continuum, Renegade 2, "Tiberian Twillight" und mehr.
Hintergrund - Wieso gibt es jetzt (erst) Antworten
TiberFCSL, ein User mit angeblich viel Hintergrundwissen, ging in die C&C3; Foren von Electronic Arts und beschuldigte diese der Zerstörung der Westwood Studios und der Zweckentfremdung der Command & Conquer Idee.
EALA Cypher antwortete darauf im EA Forum und stellte klar, dass die Anschuldigungen nicht auf Tatsachen beruhen und somit Größtenteils falsch sind. TiberFCSL ging daraufhin ins Forum von Petroglyph und fragte direkt nach - mit Erfolg.
Adam Isgreen hatte genug von den vielen Diskussionen und Theorien und machte einen Forenbeitrag, nach eigenen Angaben seinen letzten zu diesem Thema, da ihm der ständige Flame-Krieg gegen Electronic Arts wegen der alten C&C-Teile; auf die Nerven geht. Er betont erneut, dass es nichts bringt auf EA herumzuhaken, denn EA hat zwar wie jeder Spieleentwickler Fehler, macht diese aber natürlich nicht mit Absicht. Sie wollen keine schlechten Spiele machen, dies sollte man in Erinnerung behalten. Anschließend geht er auf einzelne Themen der C&C; Vergangenheit ein.
Erklärungen - Kurz-Geschichte von Westwood, EALA und Petroglyph
Im Folgenden kommen diverse Abkürzungen vor, das Wichtigste, dass man dazu wissen muss um diese verstehen zu können:
Die Westwood Studios (1985-2003) wurden 1985 als Westwood Associates von Brett Sperry und Louis Castle in Las Vegas, Nevada gegründet. Später kam die Location nahe Los Angeles, direkt am Pazifik, hinzu. Es ist daher die Rede von WW (Westwood), WWP (Westwood Pacific) und WWLV (Westwood Las Vegas).
1998 erfolgte die Übernahme durch Electronic Arts. Das Studio Westwood Pacific in Irvine, Kalifornien wurde von den Westwood Studios in Las Vegas geführt und half bei der Entwicklung von Spielen wie Nox und  C&C; Alarmstufe Rot 2. Später wurde Westwood Pacific zu EA Pacific. Electronic Arts hatte bereits zwei Locations in Los Angeles (BelAir und Playa).
März 2003 wurden die Westwood Studios zusammen mit EA Pacific (Westwood Pacific) und DreamWorks Interactive (Spieleentwicklungsstudio von Steven Spielberg, ebenfalls von EA übernommen) zu EALA (Electronic Arts Los Angeles). Nicht alle WW-Mitarbeiter wollten jedoch von Las Vegas wegziehen und verzichtete daher auf einen Job bei EALA, manche wurden auch entlassen. Ein Teil der früheren WW-Mitarbeiter gründete daher am 1. April 2003 Petroglyph, am 25. Juni 2004 zogen sie in ihr eignes Firmengebäude (Petroglyph, 2450 Box Canyon Drive, Las Vegas, NV. 89128 als Google Earth Tipp), nahe dem alten von Westwood (2400 North Tenaya Way, Las Vegas, NV 89128).
Zum Zeitpunkt der Übernahme arbeiteten über 100 Mitarbeiter für WW. Für Electronic Arts arbeiten noch 5-6 Westwood Las Vegas und 7-8 Westwood Pacific Angestellte, darunter leitende Personen wie Louis Castle.
Zudem wird im Folgenden häufig von verschiedenen Versionen der C&C3; Geschichte die Rede sein, genauer gesagt von vier Versionen. WWv1 und WWv2 sind Version 1 und 2 von Westwood, EAv1 und EAv2 sind die Versionen der Story von EA, wobei EAv2 dann vermutlich am Ende in Tiberium Wars zum Einsatz kam.
Spieleliste Louis Castle
Command & Conquer 3: Tiberium Wars (2007), Electronic Arts, Inc.
The Lord of the Rings: The Battle for Middle Earth II (2006), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Star Wars: Empire at War - Forces of Corruption (2006), LucasArts
The Lord of the Rings: The Battle for Middle-Earth II - The Rise of the Witch-King (2006), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Renegade (2002), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Pirates: The Legend of Black Kat (2002), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Yuri's Revenge (2001), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Emperor: Battle for Dune (2001), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Nox (2000), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Tiberian Sun (1999), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Tiberian Sun (Platinum Edition) (1999), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Lands of Lore III (1999), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Blade Runner (1997), Virgin Interactive Entertainment, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Red Alert (1997), Virgin Interactive Entertainment, Inc.
Lands of Lore: Guardians of Destiny (1997), Virgin Interactive Entertainment, Inc.
Monopoly (1995), Hasbro Interactive, Inc.
Pinocchio (1995), Buena Vista Games, Inc., Virgin Interactive Entertainment, Inc.
The Lion King (1994), Virgin Interactive Entertainment, Inc., Walt Disney Computer Software, Inc.
The Legend of Kyrandia: Hand of Fate (1993), Virgin Games, Inc.
Young Merlin (1993), Virgin Games, Inc.
DragonStrike (1992), FCI, Pony Canyon, Inc.
Dungeons & Dragons: Warriors of the Eternal Sun (1992), SEGA Enterprises Ltd.
Circuit's Edge (1990), Infocom
DragonStrike (1990), Strategic Simulations, Inc.
A Nightmare on Elm Street (1989), Monarch Development
Mars Saga (1989), Infocom
BattleTech: The Crescent Hawk's Inception (1988), Infocom
California Games (1988), Epyx, Inc.
Donald's Alphabet Chase (1988), Disney Software
Spieleliste Brett Sperry
Star Wars: Empire at War - Forces of Corruption (2006), LucasArts
Command & Conquer: Renegade (2002), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Earth & Beyond (2002), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Pirates: The Legend of Black Kat (2002), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Yuri's Revenge (2001), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Emperor: Battle for Dune (2001), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Red Alert 2 (2000), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Red Alert 2 (Collector's Edition) (2000), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Tiberian Sun - Firestorm (2000), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Nox (2000), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Tiberian Sun (1999), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Tiberian Sun (Platinum Edition) (1999), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Lands of Lore III (1999), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Sports Car GT (1999), Electronic Arts, Inc.
Dune 2000 (1998), Westwood Studios, Inc.
Blade Runner (1997), Virgin Interactive Entertainment, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Red Alert - Counterstrike (1997), Virgin Interactive Entertainment, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Red Alert - The Aftermath (1997), Virgin Interactive Entertainment, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Sole Survivor (1997), Westwood Studios, Inc.
Command & Conquer (Special Gold Edition) (1997), Westwood Studios, Inc.
Games People Play: Hearts, Spades, and Euchre (1997), Westwood Studios, Inc.
Lands of Lore: Guardians of Destiny (1997), Virgin Interactive Entertainment, Inc.
Command & Conquer: Red Alert (1996), Virgin Interactive Entertainment, Inc.
Command & Conquer: The Covert Operations (1996), Virgin Interactive Entertainment, Inc.
Command & Conquer (1995), Virgin Interactive Entertainment (Europe) Ltd.
Monopoly (1995), Hasbro Interactive, Inc.
The Legend of Kyrandia: Malcolm's Revenge (1994), Virgin Interactive Entertainment, Inc.
The Lion King (1994), Virgin Interactive Entertainment, Inc., Walt Disney Computer Software, Inc.
Lands of Lore: The Throne of Chaos (1993), Virgin Games, Inc.
The Legend of Kyrandia: Hand of Fate (1993), Virgin Games, Inc.
Young Merlin (1993), Virgin Games, Inc.
Dune II: The Building of a Dynasty (1992), Virgin Games, Inc.
Dungeons & Dragons: Warriors of the Eternal Sun (1992), SEGA Enterprises Ltd.
The Legend of Kyrandia (1992), Virgin Games, Inc.
Eye of the Beholder (1991), Strategic Simulations, Inc.
Eye of the Beholder II: The Legend of Darkmoon (1991), Strategic Simulations, Inc.
Circuit's Edge (1990), Infocom
DragonStrike (1990), Strategic Simulations, Inc.
Mars Saga (1989), Infocom
BattleTech: The Crescent Hawk's Inception (1988), Infocom
California Games (1988), Epyx, Inc.
Donald's Alphabet Chase (1988), Disney Software
Renegade 2 - "Battlegrounds"
Renegade 2 erreichte den "Pre-Pro"-Satus, es gab eine "X slice" Demo und die Entwickler warteten nur noch auf das Finale "Go", als die Entwicklung eingestellt wurde. Natürlich war EA nicht einfach nur fies, sondern es gab Gründe für diese Entscheidung. Battlefield stand in den Startlöchern und  Doom 3 sollte im selben Jahr erscheinen (welches dann aber erst zwei Jahre später kam). EA wollte es nicht riskieren, von Anfang an ein Nr. 3 Game herauszubringen, Renegade 2 hatte schließlich auch keine Top-Grafik, womit man sich in der Presse immer messen lassen muss. Die Entscheidungsträger von Westwood und Electronic Arts entschieden daher das Projekt einzustellen. Das Entwickler-Team selbst war über die Entscheidung nicht glücklich, sie hätten ihr Spiel gerne fertiggestellt.
Inzwischen gibt es aber bereits wieder neue Gerüchte über ein neues Renegade, welche indirekt auch schon bestätigt wurden.
Alarmstufe Rot 2 - Storyprobleme
Mit Alarmstufe Rot 2 kam der Bruch in der Storyreihenfolge "Alarmstufe Rot -> C&C1; -> Tiberian Sun". Westwood Las Vegas hätte die Serie gerne so gesehen, im Original wäre  Alarmstufe Rot (1) so zu C&C0; geworden. "Alarmstufe Rot 2 war ein großartiges Spiel, aber wir hatten Probleme damit, es so unterzubringen, dass es in die von uns gewünschte Zeitlinie passte. Wir fanden aber einen kreativen Weg um das Problem zu lösen. Dieser wäre in WWv2 der C&C3; GDI Kampagne zum Einsatz gekommen. Yuri, ein Gefolgsmann von Kane (Nod experimentierte mit Psionik (biologische Veränderungen) in der WWv2 Story), wird in einen Chrono-Strudel gezogen, welcher durch eine Chronosphere verursacht wird, die unbeabsichtigt von der GDI aktiviert wurde (zusammen mit anderen Alarmstufe Rot Technologien), während sie versuchen den einzigen anderen existierenden Anzug der Macht aus den abgeschotteten Gewölben in Area 51 zu bekommen (der Erste schmolz beim Wiedereintritt aus dem Orbit, als die Philadelphia zerstört wurde).", so Adam Isgreen.
Einstein versucht eine Rissbildung in der Zeitlinie der "echten" Zeit durch eine kleine Reise zurück in die Vergangenheit in Alarmstufe Rot zu beheben, daduch wird Yuris Präsenz in der bereits gealterten Zeitlinie die neue Realität von Alarmstufe Rot 2. Die Alarmstufe Rot Spiele wären in der gespliteten Realität fortgesetzt worden.
Adam Isgreen abschießend: "So wäre das erklärt worden. Ende der Story dazu."
C&C; Continuum
Die Entwicklung von C&C; Continuum wurde gestoppt, da das Team bei der Entwicklung von Earth & Beyond Online mithalf. Eine Entscheidung von Westwood, auch wenn Electronic Arts bereits Publisher war.
"Einer der drei schlimmsten Fehler die wir bei Westwood je machten", so Isgreen.
C&C; Bibel
Die Bibel war eine Marketing-Idee, zu der die Entwickler nichts beigetragen hatten. Die interne Version war schlecht geschrieben, hatte keinen Zusammenhang und ignorierte alle, die an der C&C; Story gearbeitet hatten. Sie war bereits unaktuell, als sie das erste Mal geschrieben wurde und es gab keine späteren Aktualisierungen mehr. Später gab es weitere Versionen, aber die Interne war unbrauchbar, so ebenso die Aussage von Isgreen.
Wenn es daher heißt, man hat sich an der C&C; Bibel orieniert, hat dies nicht unbedingt etwas gutes zu heißen. Ebenso kann man niemand (Westwood oder EA Entwicklern) einen Vorwurf machen, dass oder wenn er sich nicht an das, was in ihr stand, hielt.
Nicht zu verwechseln ist die C&C; Bibel aber mit dem neuen Buch, welches EALA vor der Entwicklung von C&C3;: Tiberium Wars zu internen Zwecken anfertigen lies und z.B. auf der E3 2006 hinter geschlossenen Türen auch der Presse kurz zeigte.
C&C3; Stories / Versionen
Die Story von C&C3; änderte sich mit jedem neuen Entwicklungsstandort / Produzenten. Aus diesem Grund gibt es mindestens vier Versionen von C&C3; (WWv1, WWv2, EAv1, EAv2), welche verschiedene Fraktionen und Story Konzepte haben. Adam Isgreen arbeitete an den Westwood Versionen 1 und 2 und der EA Version 1 mit. EA Version 2 ist am ehesten die Story, die am Ende in Tiberium Wars zum Einsatz kam. WWv2 war ähnlich der EAv1 Version (oder mit nur leichten Veränderungen).
Die Entwicklung von WWv1 begann direkt nach dem Release der  Tiberian Sun Erweiterung  Feuersturm und wurde von WWLV freiwillig für die Arbeit an C&C; Continuum gestoppt. Alle existierenden Dokumente gingen an Westwood Pacific als Ideen für Alarmstufe Rot 2 und  Yuris Rache. Einige der Einheiten in Yuris Rache sind daher geänderte Versionen der ersten C&C3; Pläne.
Für WWv2 startete die Entwicklung gegen Ende der Existenz von Westwood Las Vegas, kurz vor der Zusammenlegung der Studios. Bei EALA ging es noch ein wenig weiter, bevor sich die Pläne wieder auflösten, da alle an  Die Stunde Null mitarbeiten mussten. Wenn bereits ein C&C; in Entwicklung ist, sollte man seine Kräfte eben auf dieses konzentieren und nicht mehrere C&C; gleichzeitig entwickeln.
EAv1 war der wirkliche offizielle Neustart von C&C3;, an welchem EALA arbeitete. Die Arbeiten an EAv1 wurden eingestellt um bei  Der Herr der Ringe: Die Schlacht um Mittelerde,  Medal of Honor und Goldeneye zu helfen. Die Version wurde danach nie wieder wirklich fortgesetzt.
Danach kam vermutlich EAv2, aus welcher dann  C&C; Tiberium Wars wurde.
Personal
Mit der Zusammenlegung von EA Pacific (Westwood Pacific), Westwood Las Vegas und Dreamworks Interactive wurden manche Mitarbeiter entlassen, andere bekamen Jobs bei EA Los Angeles oder EA Redwood Shores angeboten. Einige nahmen die Jobs an, andere nicht. In Las Vegas gab es keine weiteren Spieleentwickler, daher war die Wahl entweder in eine andere Branche zu wechseln oder z.B. nach Los Angeles umzuziehen.
Mitarbeiter des Westwood Las Vegas Teams arbeitete zwar nie an  C&C; Generäle, aber die meisten arbeiteten an C&C; Generäle: Die Stunde Null mit, andere an Medal of Honor. Danach halfen viele bei der Herr der Ringe Serie.
Incursion - Tiberian/Tiberium Twilight und andere Namen
Incursion war ein Arbeitstitel für eine Version von C&C3; - wobei die Fans dachten der Name wäre Twilight.
"Wir haben C&C3; nie (ok, mit einer Ausnahme, aber das war ein Versehen) "Tiberium Twilight" genannt, jeder dachte nur, dass das Spiel diesen Namen wegen den beiden Vorgängern Tiberian Dawn und Tiberian Sun bekommen würde und anfangs war alles als Triologie über den Tiberiumkrieg, Kane, usw. gedacht. Ich kann aber niemand Schuld für diese logische Schlussfolgerung geben, schließlich macht sie viel Sinn." - Isgreen
Continuum war der Online-Rollenspiel Titel, wie oben beschrieben.
Renegade 2 hatte (intern) den Namen Battlegrounds oder etwas ähnliches.
Originalpost von TiberFCSL (EA Foren)
First, you destroy Westwood Studios as a separate company, then every WW employee lefts EA because they didn't like the way things were working (it's not a coincidence that almost every ex-WW left EALA after making Generals. What's in EA that made former WW employees to go away? I think EA didn't let the great artists to do their work, to use the best of their creativity, that's why Generals is the way it is). You stole the C&C; series from their creators, you steal an art masterpiece because of money, you made an RTS (Generals) that doesn't even deserve its name, the worst C&C; ever made.
Back in the days of Westwood, the great artists were creating C&C; Continuum and Renegade 2 and EA just cancelled them!! They would've been very innovative especially Continuum, an action RPG in the C& C universe...
Then you make a very buggy compilation of C&C; games with more bugs than the originals, even with some games without the ability of LAN play, with a terrible bad support...
Then, you made a game in the tiberium universe WITHOUT tiberium (but the so called EA's New Tiberium), with hundreds of issues about continuity, well, a nice game, but a very bad sequel. And you didn't even follow the ideas of the WW's storyline, when you could because you own that documents. This is not like Mozart's Requiem, he never finished it because he died, this is like stealing the scores with Mozart alive and doing everything that you want.
No subterranean technology, technology going backwards for Nod (they had a good Stealth Generator in TS but is was replaced with the Disruption thing), too boring FMV's, etc etc are in TW.
So you didn't follow what WW planned, even when you could contact Petroglyph to make the game together, to make a great Piece Of Art not just a product that makes money. Remember, former WW employees are not dead and they can still continue making their masterpiece that is the C&C; Franchise. I read somewhere "C&C3; would explain how RA2 fits into the tiberian storyline", an interesting story written by WW that EA didn't used in C&C3...;
Now you make another compilation (C&C; Saga) with the same TFD bugs never fixed. You're failing the fans selling that product, and when in the forums someone say it's DISGUSTING you block the thread.
WW employees were good artists and much more creative than EALA's, that's what I see in C&C3.;
But of course not everything is bad... I love the C&C3; gameplay, and I find it a lot more fun than TS's. Even when the FMV are boring, they are very well done (of course not as good as RA1 or TS ones). I love the new sidebar of C& C3. I love the return of Joe Kucan as Kane. Etc etc.
Well, there are many good things, but the bad ones are bigger. A masterpiece of art unfinished and stolen to complete it by a different artist is disrespectful to its creator.
Originalpost von EALA Cypher (EA Foren)First, it was Westwood's management that decided to consolidate Westwood Studios and EA Pacific into EALA.
And not every WS employee left. Generals wasn't even made by those WS employees, for the record. However, it was made by the people that decided, on their own, to make it - EA Pacific, which was Westwood's daughter studio, Westwood Pacific, the makers of RA2 and Nox. They decided to make Generals, not EA.
Back in the days of Westwood, the great artists were creating Continuum and they cancelled it themselves, or put it on hold, to work on Earth & Beyond Online - another MMORPG THEY were creating and not EA. THEY made that decision to help out and finish E&BO.;
Battlefields wasn't that far along to get even final approval, let along get cancelled.
Then EALA asked a thrid party contractor to compile 12 games into TFD. They compiled them 'as is'. They do NOT have more bugs than the originals, but exactly the same bugs. Problem is, those games (the oldest) were designed for a specific API and OS (it was the early days of DirectX3 even and Win95, not that it even worked on DirectX back then). So lets go blame Microsofot for no reverse comaptibility with previous APIs and OS.
Then EALA made C&C3.; With a few, already admitted, continuity... lapses, which can and will be explained in KW.
And yeah, they do own the documents - the same documents in which they could clearly see that Westwood had several different and contradicting ideas about how to progress the story in the future. Ideas even they themselves had misgivings about at the time.
Not to mention the little fact that it was Westwood Studios who comissioned a screen writer that worked with them on Renegade, if memory serves, to create their In-House C&C; Bible - a bible that states that Renegade happened in 2020... and not during TD. I've read that in house Bible. It's bad. And it was made during the times of Westwood Studios, NOT EALA.
You read somewhere a hindsight idea, by a former designer of Westwood Studios, who, having no choice in the matter, as RA2 was forced on him by Westwood Pacific at the time, had brainstormed some ideas, inevitably 'fantastical - non sci-fi' ideas, to reconnect that which should never be reconnected and can't be reconnected by any logical and non magical links.
And yes, C&C; Saga is announced, not to compete with TFD, but to replace it. And why not? It's of great value to C&C; fans who still don't have all games.
Hey, I know. Let's go flame all the game maker that have their games today in the bargain bin, for making us buy their games at full price at the time of release, instead of waiting a year or more for the bargain bin price. Yeay!
All I see, is a fan with a big lack of information about what really happened. With understandable idealization. However, that same idealization is in disrespect to both EALA who have created a great game in C&C3; and to the new Petroglyph Studios who are making their own new games. And in disrespect for the original creators of C&C; (be they ones who no longer with either company, ones at EALA or ones at Petroglyph) for, according to you, making a franchise that needs constant babysitting and cuddling.
Originalpost #1 von Adam Isgreen (Petroglyph Foren)Hmm... Ok, the reply isn't completely off base, nor is he totally accurate, so I'll elaborate so we can clear this up for good. I've known Cypher for a long time, so he speaks with a good amount of knowledge on these things.
BTW, this is the last post I'm ever going to make in regards this constant flame war at EA about past C&C; games. I said it before -- you need to listen to them now. Shaking your fists in anger at EA isn't productive. EA, like every game company, has its issues, but they don't want to make bad games. Keep that in mind.
Ren 2 (Battlegrounds):
Renegade 2 was finished with pre-pro, we had created an "X slice" demo and were awaiting the final "go" approval when it was canceled. I was in the meeting with Bing et al. when it was, since I was the one presenting the game to them. There are more factors than just "EA was mean!!" in that decision however -- Battlefield was on the horizon (unbeknownst to us @ WW), and DOOM 3 was scheduled to hit that year (didn't hit for 2 more, lol). EA was in the position at the time that they (EA) didn't want anything to be "#3", and let's be honest, Renegade's graphics were never top-notch. The WW execs and EA execs decided to kill going forward with the game because of those two other products coming into the marketplace at around the same time.
IMO, neither would have impacted it, but at the time, that was the decision and the grounds for it. Everyone on the team was crushed. We all loved it dearly. I couldn't say anything about the decision for several days until an official announcement went out, which was hell since everyone was very excited about the game and its potential.
RA2's continuity:
Yes, the solution to RA2's complete break of the RA -> C&C; -> TS fiction was something that several of us came up with to "fix" the problem. RA being the prequel was what we (Westwood LV) intended for the series. It was originally called C&C0;, FYI. RA2 was a great game, but we had issues with how to fit that into the timeline we wanted to maintain. We found a creative way to fix it. It's in the WWv2 C&C3; GDI campaign. Yuri, an acolyte of Kane's (Nod was experimenting with psionics in the WWv2 C&C3;) is sucked into a chrono-vortex that is created by a Chronosphere that GDI inadvertently activates (along with some other RA-era tech) while attempting to retrieve the only other existing suit of powered "screaming eagle" commando armor (the first was melted on re-entry from orbit when the Philadelphia was destroyed) from the sealed tech vaults at Area 51.
Just like Einstein fracturing the timeline from "real" time with his little trip back into the past in RA, so did Yuri's presence throw off the already-altered timeline again, creating the RA2 reality. RA games would have continued in that splintered reality.
That is how it would have been explained. End of story on that.
Continuum:
Yep, stopped to help E&B; out. One of the three worst mistakes we ever made at WW.
C&C; Bible:
The bible was a marketing idea that none of us had any time to contribute to. The internal version was badly written, had no continuity and ignored by all of us that worked on the C&C; story. It was out of date the moment it was first written and was never updated after. There were versions done later, but the internal one... yikes.
Story / versions / etc.
The C&C3; story changed with each new location / producer and time period it went through. There are at least 4 versions of C&C3; (WWv1, WWv2, EAv1, EAv2) that had different factions and story concepts. I worked on the WWv1/2 and EAv1 versions. EAv2 is pretty much TW. The WWv2 story was the one that the EAv1 was going to use as well (or a modified version thereof).
WWv1 started right after Firestorm shipped, and we voluntarily stopped it to work on Continuum. All existing design docs were given to WWP for ideas for RA2 / Yuris. Some of the units in Yuris are modified versions of that first C&C3; design.
WWv2 started towards the end of WWLV's existence, right before the consolidation. It continued on for a bit at EALA before sputtering because all of us working on it were put onto ZH.
EAv1 was the real official restart of C&C3;, which we worked on in both EALA locations (BelAir and Playa). EAv1 was stopped to help LotR, Goldeneye and MoH. It was never really picked back up.
After that version, I'm going to assume that the next one was TW, since I was gone at that point.
Staff:
When WW/WWP was consolidated, many people were fired outright and others were offered jobs at EALA or EARS. Some took the jobs, some didn't. Living in a city that has no other game companies (Vegas), your reality of choices was -- stay in Vegas and find other work (non-industry), go with EA to LA or SF and maybe continue your project, or go to another company and move anyway.
All of the WWLV design & production staff that did go to EALA eventually left or were fired before TW was started on. There are still some technical and artistic people at EALA that worked on the previous WWLV C&C; games.
The WWLV team didn't work on Generals, but almost all of us worked on ZH (while some were on MoH) and many worked on the LotR series after that.
WWLV/WWP:
The decisions of who decided on what project isn't as clear-cut as they were made out in the response. There were some political issues between WWP and WWLV and EA management that I won't get into because way it's too much bad blood, but the picture painted isn't the whole story.
So that's that. Done, spent, fini. Now if you'll excuse me, I'm going to get back to making U@W a franchise that kicks major ass.
A-
--------------------
Ishmael - PG
Creative Director, Petroglyph
Originalpost #2 von Adam Isgreen (Petroglyph Foren)
Let's see if I can clear some of this up:
Incursion was a working title for one iteration of C&C; 3 -- what people thought was called Twilight.
We never (ok, except one time on accident) ever called C&C3; "Tiberium Twilight", everyone just assumed it would be named that because of Dawn / Sun for the first two, and it was initially meant as a trilogy of games about the Tiberium war, Kane, etc. I can't blame people for making the logic jump there though, it makes a lot of sense.
Continuum was the MMO working title. I still like that one a lot.
Renegade 2 was called Battlegrounds or something like that internally... can't remember specifically.
--------------------
Ishmael - PG
Creative Director, Petroglyph
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